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+--- Thread: Need Advice--gifted 78 Ch. Talbot (/thread-16857.html)
- Ianaman - 11-21-2002
I'm not particularly wine savvy and I was just given a case of 1978 Chateau Talbot as a wedding present. I haven't opened a bottle yet because I've never had a wine that old before and I'm a little intimidated. Do I need to store it in any special way? How can I find out more about this vineyard and vintage? What should I expect? And how can I find out how valuable it is?
- Bucko - 11-21-2002
Talbot is a fourth-growth in the St. Julien region of Bordeaux. Many people feel it is underrated. 1978 was an okay year for Talbot, not great. The wine needs to consumed now. Don't worry about value - enjoy the gift.
Bucko
- Thomas - 11-22-2002
I am particularly disturbed by the fact that you are "intimidated" by the wine. The American wine industry--and the so-called writers who cover it--should be ashamed of itself for not addressing the fact that so many Americans feel that way about wine.
- wondersofwine - 11-22-2002
I don't have much experience with older wines either. I do have three different vintages of Chateau Talbot on hand--all from the 90's. It may be necessary to decant the wine an hour before drinking it to check for sediment in the bottom of the bottle and to let the wine breath. Others on this forum can tell you how to decant a wine.
- winecollector - 11-22-2002
As far as storage is concerned, if you have a basement, keep it there... away from your furnace or other source of heat, laying on it's side, and away from light. Ideal wine storage is around 55 to 57 degrees, but as long as it doesn't go below 50 in the winter and above 70 in the summer you should be okay. Bucko is correct in that you should "enjoy the gift," drink it with your new bride and enjoy! I would caution though on decanting this wine beforehand and letting it sit for any lengh of time before drinking it... as much of the fruit may disipate after the first hour on a wine this old and from this vintage. Enjoy!
- winoweenie - 11-22-2002
Hi Anaman and welcome to the board. Someone must hold you in high regard. I had this wine 2 years ago and it was drinking superbly. I agree with WC on not decanting the wine as it is at the top and is very fragile. Stand the bottle upright for 24 hours then open this beauty about an hour before you want to start drinking it. Pour carefully and enjoy. Congratulations on your gittin' hitched. May you have the whole alpabet from B to Z. WW
- Ianaman - 11-22-2002
Thank you so much for all the great advice. I agree that it is a gift primarily for enjoyment, but my concern about the value relates much more to my desire to not intimidate others by giving them a $200 bottle of wine (if that is indeed the value).
I would disagree that this "intimidation factor" is still being actively perpetuated by wine publications, et al. Rather, I think that wineries and wine publications, particularly in the new world, are trying very hard to dispel the notion of wine's exclusivity to create a broader customer base. I think French wines, however, have not done much to help, because it keeps their per bottle values higher, though comparative quality is not that much better (if at all).
Anyhow, apart from that, I know that a first growth is better than a fourth growth, but why, and what does it really mean?
- joeyz6 - 11-23-2002
Hi Ianaman,
Here is a link to a web site that was passed along to me from another member of this board a while ago ... it explains the Bordeaux classification pretty well:
http://www.klwines.com/1855_classification.asp
I have to say, I don't completely agree that French wines are trying to maintain an exclusivity. Wine here is so different ... as Roberto has said on different threads, wine is a grocery in Europe. I've observed that now quite a bit here. American wine companies often seem to want us to think that wine is for special occasions, and thus should be expensive. Here people think that wine should be cheap and that it should still be good. And it usually is.
In addition, it seems to me that part of the reason why French and Italian wines are so expensive in America is that there are so many taxes imposed on them. A 10-euro bottle here that people would serve with a nice formal dinner probably ends up costing about 20 or 25 in the States and
'intimidates' people.
- winoweenie - 11-23-2002
Hi agin' "I" and tho I normally don't answer the price question when the wine was a gift I'll make an exception. The wine currently retails between 60-75 bucks. WW
- Thomas - 11-23-2002
Thanks, JoeyZ, for your support in my theory. I hear so often that Europeans are trying to rip us off with wine prices, when that really is not the rule--some are, of course, but most are not.
I just brought in some Italian wines that began in Italy at a wholesale bottle price of $3.00; by the time the wines arrived at my door, I had to charge $14 a bottle in order to pay my bills--the shipper, customs, BATF, importer, distributor, and NY State all had to first get their cut.
Lanaman, a first growth is not "better" than a fourth growth--better is always relative. But a first growth has the advantage of commanding more money, and in America that means more respect. Check out the site recommended to see what the "growth" system really means.
I still do not understand the intimidation factor to which you refer. If you were to serve me a first growth that commanded a lot of money, far from intimidated, I would feel honored that you are willing to share it with me.
- joeyz6 - 11-23-2002
I myself owe thanks to Foodie, Roberto and several others on this board for enlightening me with that theory about European wines.
- Ianaman - 11-23-2002
Perhaps intimidation is the wrong word for it. Anyhow, I'm not sure I really understand the classification system and its purpose. If a first growth is not "better" why does it command more money? If that is not an example of certain French wineries fostering a sense of exclusivity to keep prices up, what is?
I agree that generalizing this trend to encompass all of Europe is not really accurate, but I really believe that many of the older vineyards in ancient wine producing regions are involved.
Also, I have heard that many strains of French grape were all but wiped out by disease in the last century and had to be replenished by stocks from California. If this is true, then that suggests to me that these classifications have even less substance than I previously thought.
- winoweenie - 11-24-2002
That is partly trie I. When the great louse hit France the major wineries replanted with the same clone of grapes they had sent earlier to America to start our vineyards. So they still have their original varietals only now they're young vines compared to the original plantings. (Very compressed explanation ). WW
- Thomas - 11-25-2002
Guys, guys--all wrong.
When phylloxera hit Europe the answer was to use American root stocks to revitalize the vineyards. It was native American root stock, because they are immune to the louse that attacked the European Vineyards. The reason the louse got to Europe was through transportation of American vines to Europe, and not the other way around.
The root stock that saved European vineyards came first from Missouri, and then from the East Coast, where the native American vines existed. California had nothing whatsoever to do with it.
European vines have been grafted onto American root stock ever since.
There is an awful lot of confusion regarding wine, and sometimes pieces of stories get mixed into pieces of other stories, kind of like the game we used to play as children--whisper something in someone's ear, that someone whispers into someone ele's ear, and so on, until the last person gets information that bears no resemblance to the first.